PZ Myers. 2005 Oct 17. I must be a sci-fi pop culture freak. <http://pharyngula.org/index/weblog/i_must_be_a_sci_fi_pop_culture_freak/>. Accessed 2006 Jan 29.
Posted on M00o93H7pQ09L8X1t49cHY01Z5j4TT91fGfr on Monday, October 17, 2005
I must be a sci-fi pop culture freak
I've been a fan of SF since I was a little tyke (I remember when my dad let me read A Princess of Mars—he warped my brain at an early age), so how can I resist this meme at Byzantium's Shores? It's Scalzi's list of the most influential science fiction films. Put the ones you've seen in bold.
- The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension!
- Akira
- Alien
- Aliens
- Alphaville
- Back to the Future
- Blade Runner
- Brazil
- Bride of Frankenstein
- Brother From Another Planet
- A Clockwork Orange
- Close Encounters of the Third Kind
- Contact
- The Damned
- Destination Moon
- The Day The Earth Stood Still
- Delicatessen
- Escape From New York
- ET: The Extraterrestrial
- Flash Gordon: Space Soldiers (serial)
- The Fly (1985 version)
- Forbidden Planet
- Ghost in the Shell
- Gojira/Godzilla
- The Incredibles
- Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1956 version)
- Jurassic Park
- Mad Max 2/The Road Warrior
- The Matrix
- Metropolis
- On the Beach
- Planet of the Apes (1968 version)
- Robocop
- Sleeper
- Solaris (1972 version)
- Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
- Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope
- Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
- The Stepford Wives
- Superman
- Terminator 2: Judgement Day
- The Thing From Another World
- Things to Come
- Tron
- 12 Monkeys
- 28 Days Later
- 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
- 2001: A Space Odyssey
- La Voyage Dans la Lune
- War of the Worlds (1953 version)
It's easier to explain the ones I haven't seen. I've heard of Alphaville, but I've never seen a DVD of it. For some reason, I've always been interrupted when watching Contact, and have only seen snatches of it. I didn't know Delicatessen was SF, or I'd have plucked it off the shelf. I've seen a few of the Flash Gordon serials, but I don't know if I've seen the one listed. I didn't know there was a 1972 version of Solaris! I also didn't even know a movie had been made of H.G. Wells' Things to Come. As for La Voyage Dans la Lune, that's waaaay before my time. I've seen the usual excerpts from it, but not the whole thing.
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Alphaville made me fall asleep (in a movie theater). Nobody will tell me how it ended.
#: Posted by Bob Davis on 10/17 at 06:43 PM
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Run, do not walk, to your local video store, and rent Delicatessen.
Do it.
Do it now.#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:02 PM -
I wouldn't call Clockwork Orange a science fiction movie (or a science fiction book). More a film about a dystopia set in the not-too-distant future. It's no more science fiction than 1984.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:08 PM
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indeed, do see Delicatessen. also see The Cook, The Thief, His Wife, and Her Lover. they're neither one of them sci-fi, or anything much like it, but they're very well worth renting.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:10 PM
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What? no Repoman? no Forbin Project? For Shame.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:35 PM
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What? no Repoman? no Forbin Project? For shame.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:36 PM
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I have two (2) film degrees, so I think I'm morally obligated to do the whole list:
The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension!
Akira
Alien
Aliens
Alphaville
Back to the Future
Blade Runner
Brazil
Bride of Frankenstein
Brother From Another Planet
A Clockwork Orange
Close Encounters of the Third Kind
Contact
The Damned
Destination Moon
The Day The Earth Stood Still
Delicatessen
Escape From New York
ET: The Extraterrestrial
Flash Gordon: Space Soldiers (serial) - but I did see the 1980s version!
The Fly (1985 version)
Forbidden Planet
Ghost in the Shell
Gojira/Godzilla
The Incredibles
Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1956 version)
Jurassic Park
Mad Max 2/The Road Warrior
The Matrix
Metropolis
On the Beach
Planet of the Apes (1968 version)
Robocop
Sleeper
Solaris (1972 version)
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope
Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
The Stepford Wives - but it's on my NetFlix list
Superman
Terminator 2: Judgement Day
The Thing From Another World
Things to Come
Tron
12 Monkeys
28 Days Later - Again, on my NetFlix list
20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
2001: A Space Odyssey
La Voyage Dans la Lune
War of the Worlds (1953 version)
In my film-geek opinion, this list isn't nearly extensive enough. Where is The Space Children? Or Creature from the Black Lagoon? Or The Day The Earth Caught Fire? Or The Quatermass Xperiment?#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:48 PM -
What a weird list. It seems to me like a strange mixture of what the SF community would deem influential on SF itself, what the SF community would deem influential on the mainstream perception of SF, and what the film community would deem influential for historical reasons – along with some choices that are just odd (Contact was influential?).
Just looked at Scalzi's description of what he did:
the part of the book that's going to get most people's attention -- and raise hackles -- is The Canon, which features the 50 science fiction films I have deemed to be the most significant in the history of film. Note that "most significant" does not mean "best" or "most popular" or even "most influential." Some of the films may be all three of these, but not all of them are -- indeed, some films in The Canon aren't objectively very good, weren't blockbusters and may not have influenced other filmmakers to any significant degree. Be that as it may, I think they matter -- in one way or another, they are uniquely representative of some aspect of the science fiction film experience.
Yeah, anyone doing that is probably going to come up with a weird list.
The choice that to me sticks out the most as weird is the inclusion of the second Terminator but not the first one, which doesn't really make sense from either an 'influence on SF' or 'influence on mainstream' perspective AFAICT.
And given the inclusion of things like Buckaroo Banzai and Brother From Another Planet, where are Dark Star and Repo Man? What about Silent Running? (Or for that matter Soylent Green?) I'm not saying I would even necessarily include all these (never even seen Soylent Green), but they do strike me as things that require a defense for not including them rather than the reverse.
Re: the 1972 Solaris – this is by Russian director Andrej Tarkovskii, and so, of course, is very much worth seeing. Not a good choice unless you're up for something long, slow, and moody though.#: Posted by on 10/17 at 07:56 PM -
George Cauldron... By most definitions, any fiction that takes place in the future is science fiction. Brazil is hardly more science fiction-y than A Clockwork Orange, except in its more elaborate production design.
My first thought upon seeing this canon was, "Buckaroo Banzai isn't nearly as influential as it should have been. Couldn't even get a sequel made." Upon later thought, I guess being endlessly quoted is influence enough.#: Posted by on 10/17 at 08:01 PM -
I second Silent Running (1972 with Bruce Dern) as being more than worthing for the list, and Soylent Green as well. While we at it why not Logan's Run?
#: Posted by AndyS on 10/17 at 08:08 PM
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Flash Gordon Conquers the Universe is defintiely the best of the serialized Flash Gordons (and not just for the hyperbolic title). I have a soft spot for the q980's Flash Gordon, with the Queen soundtrack though... Anyway.
I think I'm almost exactly on Par with you, PZ, except that I've also seen Akira and Contact<> all the way through. Netflix them if you get a chance but feel free to fast forward through some of the more ponderous bits (of Contact. Akira makes no sense at all, no matter at what speed you watch it).
While I haven't seen <I>Delicitessen I have seen every other film by Carro and think that City of Lost Children should really have been on that list instead of, say, Empire Strikes Back.#: Posted by Keith on 10/17 at 08:23 PM -
I saw the original 1972 version of Solaris before the George Clooney remake. It was long and moody but so much more interesting and mysterious and open to interpretation than the remake. Definately see it.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 08:30 PM
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I'd rather see Barbarella (1968), the greatest SF psychedelic sex comedey ever made on the list than Tron, which is booooooring.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 08:32 PM
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Tarkovski's Solaris is very long and feels even longer. Lots of cool sci-fi films are missing from this list (as far as I am concerned), including some of those mentioned in the comments (Soylent Green, Dark Star, Creature from the Black Lagoon). How about The Incredible Shrinking Man? Tarantula? Fantastic Voyage? Aelita? Various versions of Frankenstein? 1984 (the movie)? Journey to the Center of the Earth? 20,000 Leages Under The Sea?
#: Posted by coturnix on 10/17 at 08:37 PM
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Didn't The Incredibles come out in 2004? It hasn't had time to influence anything, unless we're talking this year's crop of animated movies.
#: Posted by Narc on 10/17 at 08:47 PM
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City of Lost Children is greatly superior to Delicatessen and by the same director. It is one of the greatest french sci fi flicks i've seen and much more interesting than Delicatessen. Jeunet (i think that's how it is spelled) directed Alien Resurrection and Amelie, also both highly recommended. And were are Beetlejuice and Mars Attacks! -- two totally original Timothy Burton flicks? This list is completely incomplete. How about King Kong???????? They've got Godzilla!!!
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 08:59 PM
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Jurassic Park? HAHA, I hate that movie. Here's another great movie that was left off of this pathetic list: XANADU. Any list without this movie isn't worth taking seriously.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 09:13 PM
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Perhaps Contact was ground breaking because the lead was female and she wasn't required to emmulate male fantasy stereotypes. In other words when she was hurt she cried and waited for help to arrive instead of grabbing a laser machine gun and kicking arse.
As for Akira, if you live in Japan for a couple of years then I'm not saying the movie will make sense, but it will starts not making sense in a way that seems sensible.#: Posted by Ronald Brak on 10/17 at 09:23 PM -
Was the original idea "SF movies you have to see before you die"? Subjectively I would much rather have included these:
Fifth Element
Dune
Silent Running
Donnie Darko
Gattaca (took itself a bit too seriously, but anyway)
Village of the Damned
Dr. Strangelove
Soylent Green
Stalker
The Abyss
Barbarella
The Fly (1958)
The Day Of The Triffids
The Terminator
Cube
Strange Days
plus either Galaxy Quest or Star Wreck 6 (http://www.starwreck.com)
...than these:
The Incredibles - Not too bad, but wouldn't put it on the list. Maybe as an example of modern animation, but it's a bit too Ayn Rand to recommend to everyone.
28 Days Later - are zombies non-SF if they are slow and vice versa? It was a good movie, but not the only zombie movie you should see before you die.
Flash Gordon: Space Soldiers (serial) - haven't seen it, and I don't think these serials find their way outside US so often. So is it really exceptional(ly campy) as a serial SF, so that even Europeans should see it before we die? Or could it be replaced by Flash Gordon of 1980 (which can be replaced by Barbarella...)
Noteworthy inclusions: Ghost in the Shell, On the Beach, Brother From Another Planet
Haven't seen THX 1138, what about that one?#: Posted by windy on 10/17 at 09:35 PM -
Alphabetical order or not, The Day the Earth Stood Still should be at the top of the list.
I too am surprised The Incredibles is on the list. And surprised that Silent Running, The Time Machine and The Incredible Shrinking Man are not.
And ... wasn't Tron really sort of a flop? I mean, I liked it, but it didn't do well. Maybe it was the depiction of cyberspace that cinched a place on the list. Hmm.
But what about ...
The Colossus of New York?
Donovan's Brain?
The Blob? (Steve McQueen)
Attack of the 50 Foot Woman?
Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea? (Walter Pidgeon! Barbara Eden! Peter Lorre! Frankie Avalon! AND flaming Van Allen Radiation Belts!!)
Earth Girls are Easy?
Fantastic Voyage?
Scanners?
King Kong?
20 Million Miles to Earth?
The Absent-Minded Professor? (Fred McMurray!)
The Andromeda Strain!? (Okay, it's Mr. Anti-Science Michael Chrichton, but still.)
And <evil grin> Escape to Witch Mountain?
Or how about <eviler grin> Doc Savage?
Bond movies?
Animated stuff (Fantastic Planet, f'rinstance)?
And um ... Okay, somebody help me out here: It was a movie with aliens who would suck you down underground. Some kind of gun thing that would dissolve the ground and make tunnels. Plucky kid involved? Don't know if it was any good, but that getting sucked under the ground made a HUGE impression on 6-year-oldish me at the time.#: Posted by Hank Fox on 10/17 at 09:43 PM -
Delicatessen isn't really sci-fi in my book - I'm not sure of in which genre you'd put it, but it's a wonderful movie. Same team as "City of the Lost Children" if you happen to know that one.
All I recall of Alphaville involves minimal sets lit by brilliant white lighting - it's been a while but I think I enjoyed it. The 1972 Solaris is the Russian original. I wasn't keen on the remake and would like to see the original. If you're the type of person who was bored during the black hole transit scene in 2001, there's supposed to be a similar scene in Solaris involving a car drive through a city.#: Posted by Neil on 10/17 at 09:51 PM -
What does "influential" mean? What did Buckaroo Banzai influence? If you want to trace influence only one movie on that list had any real influence outside the movie world: Close Encounters of the Third Kind provided the archetypal image for those Aliens From Outer Space who parked their space ships in thousands of back yards, invaded tens of thousands of suburban bedrooms, raped hundreds of housewives, implanted countless weird objects up who-knows-how-many noses; and in short fueled one of the great mass delusions of the late 20th Century. If you doubt me, check out Susan Clancy's just-published book, Abducted : how people come to believe they were kidnapped by aliens.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 10:14 PM
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If you're the type of person who was bored during the black hole transit scene in 2001, there's supposed to be a similar scene in Solaris involving a car drive through a city.
The Solaris driving scene is formally similar to the some of the end bits of 2001 in being a longish symbolic sequence without dialogue, but IIRC I don't think the comparison extends much beyond that. It's been a while, but I recall thinking the driving scene was in some ways a relatively weak bit in Solaris, that I found it a bit heavy handed.#: Posted by on 10/17 at 10:18 PM -
I didn't know Delicatessen was SF, or I'd have plucked it off the shelf.
I consider Delicatessen more dark fantasy, but can see why it would be considered science fiction. Go see it, and also make sure to get hold of City of Lost Children. Fantastic movies.#: Posted by on 10/17 at 10:24 PM -
Various versions of Frankenstein?
"Bride of Frankenstein" is on there, which is probably the best version of the story (though Hammer's "Curse of Frankenstein" is really fascinating).
And it is pretty bizarre that "Terminator 2" would be on there and not "The Terminator," especially since the original is a much better film (though the cheap special effects have not aged well).#: Posted by on 10/17 at 10:39 PM -
Okay, somebody help me out here: It was a movie with aliens who would suck you down underground. Some kind of gun thing that would dissolve the ground and make tunnels. Plucky kid involved? Don't know if it was any good, but that getting sucked under the ground made a HUGE impression on 6-year-oldish me at the time.
"Invaders from Mars." 1953. Tobe Hooper did a really bad remake in the 1980s.#: Posted by on 10/17 at 10:41 PM -
I just watched Farenheit 451 again the other day. I like the movie better each time I see it after having been disappointed the first time due to being attached to the book.
With ET and Close Encounters of the Third Kind it's the opposite. Other than a few scenes I've no interest in them anymore. The Matix? Didn't like it the first time -- still don't.
Endlessly re-watchable: The Day The Earth Stood Still.#: Posted by AndyS on 10/17 at 11:05 PM -
PZ, since I've noticed you've got a passing interest in the god vs science debate (heh!) you really must see Contact.
#: Posted by on 10/17 at 11:13 PM
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Pretty good list!
#: Posted by beajerry on 10/17 at 11:41 PM
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I was inspired to take a look at the IMDB entry on Silent Running:
First time director Douglas Trumbull worked on special effects for 2001 A Space Odyssey and was the designer of the "drones": Huey, Dewey, and Louie.
After the success of Easy Rider, Universal Studios decided to let young filmmakers make "semi-independent" films for low budgets in hopes of generating similar profits. This was one, American Graffiti another.
To keep costs down, Trumbull hired college students for modelmaking and other such special effects work.
Peter Schickele, also know as P.D.Q. Bach, wrote the movie score as well as the music for the two songs sung by Joan Baez. If you've never seen or head a P.D.Q. Bach performance, do so. (Ditto for Joan Baez
One of the three people given writing credit is Stephen Bocho. This is his only movie credit, everything else he did was for TV.
And then there is Bruce Dern being, well, Bruce Dern.#: Posted by AndyS on 10/18 at 12:08 AM -
By "Metropolis", do you mean the 1927 silent Fritz Lang movie, or the 2001 anime from Rintaro inspired by an Osamu Tekuza story ?
Both could be in the list.#: Posted by Sophie on 10/18 at 01:57 AM -
Alphaville is good if you like Goddard in general. If you find characters reading poetry out loud to be pretentious, you won't like it. Like 1984, it really isn't SF -- it's more of an allegory of totalitarianism that uses some futuristic trappings.
#: Posted by Jonathan Badger on 10/18 at 05:24 AM
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This list could be cut down in half and other sci-fi movies could be added to make the argument “most influential” more legitimate.
I would add Logan’s Run as one missing from the list. Hey, don’t laugh; yes it was a typical campy 70‘s sci-fi movie but it sure has a lot to say about how we treat the elderly and look at ourselves in western society. Besides, it is being remade for a 2007 release. Man, Hollywood needs to find new creative blood.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 07:00 AM -
Errrmm, what about The Man Who Fell to Earth, starring David Bowie, or The Man in the White Suit, starring Alec Guinness?
I can only hope that David Brin got a ton of money for the rights to The Postman. Let's Just Say (tm from another list) that Costner's best movie was American Flyers.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 08:00 AM -
I can't figure out which move "The Damned" is referring to. The ones if find in IMDB don't seem to be SF. Anybody got any ideas?
#: Posted by Janice in GA on 10/18 at 08:24 AM
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I assumed it was the one about Nazis with Charlotte Rampling...but you're right. It's not SFnal. It's a very strange list.
#: Posted by PZ Myers on 10/18 at 08:31 AM
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For some reason, I've always been interrupted when watching Contact, and have only seen snatches of it.
But at least you've seen the long long LONG pull-out opening shot, right? For me, that was reason enough to buy the DVD.
As for the ending, it turns out that Rosebud was her sled. Either that, or that Jodie Foster is made of people.#: Posted by arensb on 10/18 at 08:32 AM -
fyreflye, Buckaroo Banzai led to some in jokes in the Star Trek franchises, at least. For example, read the dedication plaque on the USS Excelsior in Star Trek 6.
As for my list, do I get to include ones I've read the scripts for?
Seen:
Back to the Future
ET: The Extraterrestrial
Jurassic Park
Planet of the Apes (1968 version)
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope
Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
Terminator 2: Judgement Day
Tron
2001: A Space Odyssey
Read script:
Blade Runner
The Day The Earth Stood Still
The Matrix
Superman#: Posted by Keith Douglas on 10/18 at 08:56 AM -
I can't figure out which move "The Damned" is referring to. The ones if find in IMDB don't seem to be SF. Anybody got any ideas?
They probably meant Children of the Damned, which is the one with the scary blond kids who can kill you with their psychic powers given to them by their alien fathers.
Hey, where's I Married A Monster From Outer Space?#: Posted by on 10/18 at 09:23 AM -
"But at least you've seen the long long LONG pull-out opening shot, right? For me, that was reason enough to buy the DVD."
Ditto on that. I'm sort of so-so on the whole movie, but that opening sequence is fantastic.
Similarly, while I'm very fond of the whole movie, the opening 2 or 3 minutes of Blade Runner is really what makes the whole thing work for me. When the friggin hell are they going to release a decent DVD of that, by the way??!!!
And I'll add to the chorus on Delicatessen and City of the Lost Children. Great stuff.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 10:11 AM -
The Joseph Losey "Damned" must count as SF, having (reference to) a spaceship in it. "Village of the Damned" is from John Wyndham's "The Midwich Cuckoos", and "Children of the Damned" is a sequel of sorts. Apparently, there's a John Carpenter remake of VotD from 1995 which I'd never heard of.
But I'm shocked you can call yourself any kind of a geek and not have seen Tarkovski's "Solaris"!
Obvious omissions:
Dark City
Demon Seed
La Jetée
The Time Machine
proper Cronenberg (e.g. The Brood)
Stalker, while I'm berating your lack of Tarkovski
The Day the World Caught Fire
They Live!
Them
and many more...#: Posted by on 10/18 at 10:16 AM -
SPOILER ALERT
This list left out a number of excellent films, such as Dark City, which had the feel of a 40's or 50's SF novel (by A.E. van Vogt, perhaps?). The scene when you see where the city really is was unforgetable, like something from an early Arthur C. Clarke novel.
Alphaville is perhaps the only science fiction movie made without any SF props or special effects; you have to visualize it for yourself--as when Lemmy Caution flies between galaxies in his car driving over a long causeway, with stars reflected in the water.
As for Silent Running, I almost walked out on it and asked for my money back when the botanist hero suddenly realizes that the plant ecologies he is taking to "safety" near Saturn are dying because they aren't getting enough sunlight! Aaaaggghhh!!!
I also missed Quatermass and the Pit (aka Five Million Years to Earth), which is ID science fiction--the Martians genetically engineered humans from protohumans to become their replacements, but something went wrong.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 10:56 AM -
At the risk of pissing everybody off, I'm going to say that the most striking feature of that list is that most of the movies aren't very good. Leaving out the ones mentioned above that aren't quite science fiction, I'd say only four of them - Alien, Forbidden Planet, 2001, 12 Monkeys - might be considered "great films" and that's giving 12 Monkeys the benefit of the doubt. In terms of genre pictures, I can name more great Westerns off the top of my head than I can great sci-fi movies.
This isn't to say I don't like a bunch of the movies on the list, just that when considered as art rather than entertainment, they tend to fall short.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 12:15 PM -
Looking at the list, I would have included the orginal King Kong, Dark City and Barbarella on it. The Matrix should definitely not be on it, as there is nothing new, good or influental about it.
Sean, I would respectfully disagree with you - Blade Runner, Brazil and Delicatessen are all moveis that can be justifiably be called great movies, and Ghost in the Shell as well as <i<Akira</i> have some merit to their claims as well. The Fly was great for its time, though time has left it behind.
The Star Wars movies have of course become iconic, as have E.T. and Close Encounters of the Third Kind.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 01:20 PM -
Other movies I think should have been included on the list (though I would have a hard time to choose which ones to remove):
The 5th Element
The Handmaid's Tale
Nineteen Eighty-Four
Maybe Charly, The Boys from Brazil, Running Man, Starship Troopers and Equilibrium.
It's hard to narrow the list down. I guess a similar list of fantasy movies would have the oposite problem - it's hard to find 50 that qualifies.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 01:33 PM -
Here's my list of the ones i've seen:
Alien
Aliens
Back to the Future
Blade Runner
Brazil
Bride of Frankenstein
A Clockwork Orange
Close Encounters of the Third Kind
The Damned
The Day The Earth Stood Still
Delicatessen
Escape From New York
ET: The Extraterrestrial
The Fly (1985 version)
Forbidden Planet
Gojira/Godzilla
Invasion of the Body Snatchers (1956 version)
Jurassic Park
Mad Max 2/The Road Warrior
The Matrix
Metropolis
Planet of the Apes (1968 version)
Robocop
Solaris (1972 version)
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope
Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
Superman
Terminator 2: Judgement Day
The Thing From Another World
Things to Come
Tron
12 Monkeys
20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
2001: A Space Odyssey
War of the Worlds (1953 version)
Here's what I would add:
The City of Lost Children
King Kong
Mighty Joe Young
Beetlejuice
Mars Attacks!
The Beast from 20000 Fathoms
20 Million Miles to Earth
Earth vs. the Flying Saucers
Killer Klowns from Outer Space
One Million Years, B.C.
Caveman
Adventures of Baron Munchausen
Eraserhead
Dune
Little Shop of Horrors
Monkey Shines
Do you agree with me or disagree?#: Posted by on 10/18 at 01:58 PM -
I notocied that in Scalzi's comment section Scalzi said that he left King Kong out because it was fantasy. I think that reasoning would lead to discarding a few on your list PSOTSAS.
Killer Klowns from Outer Space is an unknown to me, which doesn't necessarily mean that it shouldn't be included. However, it doesn't seem to have an entry in The Encyclopedia of Science Fiction by Clute and Nicholls. That would lead me to believe that it should not figure on the list.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 02:13 PM -
Would be easier to just like the ones from that list I "haven't" seen:
Alphaville, Brother From Another Planet, The Damned, Delicatessen, On The Beach, Sleeper, The Thing From Another World, Things Come, 28 Days Later and La Voyage Dans la Luna.
I am not even going to try to list ones I have watched that are not on that list, it would probably look like my book collection, which I would also have to compile from some master list of books 'before' I could give a list of the ones I have read, but don't necessarilly own. lol#: Posted by Kagehi on 10/18 at 02:36 PM -
If we're going to split hairs between sci-fi and fantasy, we won't have many films on the list at all.
#: Posted by Keith on 10/18 at 02:44 PM
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Sean, I would respectfully disagree with you - Blade Runner, Brazil and Delicatessen are all moveis that can be justifiably be called great movies, and Ghost in the Shell as well as <i<Akira</i> have some merit to their claims as well.
I'd agree with a few folks above who claimed Brazil and Delicatessen aren't science fiction, though Brazil could legitimately be called great. I personally love Delicatessen, though I'm not sure it would qualify as a great film. There are others on the list that fall into that category for me as well, like The Road Warrior and Back to the Future. As for Blade Runner, I just don't think it's particularly good. The design and visuals are spectacular, but I don't find the story or the characters to be all that interesting. For what it's worth, I feel the same way about Lord of the Rings (well, the first one. I didn't bother seeing the other two). But I think I'm pretty squarely in the minority here, so I'll give you Blade Runner. I didn't like Akira and haven't seen Ghost in the Shell, but I don't know enough about animation to offer any strong arguments about either one of them.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 03:02 PM -
I didn't like Akira or Ghost in the Shell, either -- most anime leaves me completely cold.
I think Blade Runner is a great movie, but like every movie ever made from a Dick novel, it fled from trying to capture the deep weirdness of Dick's brain. (For an incredibly bad example, see Total Recall--there's a piece of schlock that dumbed down a difficult concept to the point where it was meaningless.)#: Posted by PZ Myers on 10/18 at 03:30 PM -
I never read Philip K. Dick. I started one (Valis? I honestly don't remember) in high school, but it didn't grab me. Though I've heard universally from friends who are fans that the film adaptations always fall far short.
#: Posted by on 10/18 at 03:40 PM
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blockquote>I think Blade Runner is a great movie, but like every movie ever made from a Dick novel, it fled from trying to capture the deep weirdness of Dick's brain. (For an incredibly bad example, see Total Recall--there's a piece of schlock that dumbed down a difficult concept to the point where it was meaningless.)</blockquote>
Have you actually read "We Can Remember It for You Wholesale"? Total Recall was by no means a great movie, but it had much more dept than the orginal short story.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 04:20 PM -
Videodrome.
#: Posted by on 10/18 at 06:11 PM
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I'll highly recommend the Tarkovsky version of Solaris. It's genuinely disturbing and gripping, but in subtle ways. (I haven't seen the later version, so can't make a comparison.)
#: Posted by on 10/18 at 06:13 PM
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Okay, okay, a follow-up. Possibly the best adaptation of a PK Dick novel that he never wrote. Paranoid and brilliant at the same time. In it's skewed way, it foresaw the internet culture ("all of us will have special names").
Agree with PZ that although Blade Runner WAS great in it's way, it missed Dick's true dept and weirdness. But I'd say it's pretty great attempt.
Total Recall was a fun movie, but completely removed from the Dick's way of telling a story. PKD would have never, ever used a musclebound action hero as a protagonist.
Have you seen Barjo? It's a French movie based on Dick's Confessions of a Crap Artist. Good stuff.
Sean: read Radio Free Albemuth (can I add exclamation marks to that?). It's essentially Valis made friendly to those unused to PK Dick.#: Posted by on 10/18 at 06:25 PM -
Alphaville (1965) is one of the greatest films of any genre. Intergalactic noir detective Lemmy Caution must destroy the antihuman computer Alpha 60. It's got Eddie Constantine and Anna Karina. There are lots of deadpan jokes. And for the city of the future Godard used the buildings of contemporary Paris. Read more at http://www.ufvc.org/2003_2004/11_14_03Alphaville/alphaville.html
Spoiler for Bob Davis: Constantine asks Alpha 60 a riddle, and Alpha 60 blows up from parsing the contradiction.
A sci-fi movie that should be rescued from obscurity: Flesh Gordon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flesh_Gordon). Yes, it's childish, but I was charmed than when the spaceship took off the crew held on to subway straps, and it's got stop-motion animated monsters.#: Posted by on 10/19 at 12:21 PM -
This Island Earth (1955)
#: Posted by on 10/19 at 08:17 PM
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Too late to the party - but now that I am here I worked up some opinions:
Animes moves me a lot since they often have terrific visuals. I _must_ see Ghost In the Shell soon!
I miss Monster from the Black Lagoon too - it was sort of cute.
"Have you actually read "We Can Remember It for You Wholesale"? Total Recall was by no means a great movie, but it had much more dept than the orginal short story."
Dick's story was pure genius. (The original, I think he made a longer one later.) It compressed a lot of scifi and personality character into a very short story. I've seen it hailed as one of all times short stories, and it's definitely 1 of the top 10 for me.#: Posted by on 10/27 at 06:55 AM